Does anyone know of a good company that can print me some PCBs ? Preferably in New Zealand or Australia, but failing that one that doesn;t cost the earth to ship.
Thanks!
Mark
Why not make your own? I'm thinking of making one with one of those Radio Shack kits. It should be rather simple, based on a schematic in Jeff Ledger's PDF file. The project is an RS-232 interface using a MAX 233 chip.
I wouldnt mind one of those. Even the bare PCB :)
While youre etching one, feel like etching 2? :D
Ill swap ya for some userport connectors if you like :)
Quote from: Mark Smith on January 15, 2008, 08:23 AM
Does anyone know of a good company that can print me some PCBs ? Preferably in New Zealand or Australia, but failing that one that doesn;t cost the earth to ship.
Thanks!
Mark
I've only dealt with PCB manufacturers in China and Bulgaria. I couldn't find any affordable manufacturers in Australia.
What's the size of your PCB and how many do you need printed?
Check out this place (http://www.expresspcb.com/ExpressPCBHtm/SpecsMiniboard.htm). They've gotten good reviews online, and they ship internationally.
Express PCB even has software you can use to do your layout. From what I understand, you just need a laser printer to make an "iron on" transfer. I have an old HesModem that I'm going to use for the user port connector and the case to make my rs232 interface. A MAX 233 chip is used, and I got two samples free from Dallas/Maxim. I suppose I should make a prototype with one chip before making the board, and test it out!
Andrew: pm your snail mail address and Ill post you some connectors. Save that poor modem! :D
Quote from: Andrew Sutton on January 16, 2008, 01:34 PM
Express PCB even has software you can use to do your layout. From what I understand, you just need a laser printer to make an "iron on" transfer. I have an old HesModem that I'm going to use for the user port connector and the case to make my rs232 interface. A MAX 233 chip is used, and I got two samples free from Dallas/Maxim. I suppose I should make a prototype with one chip before making the board, and test it out!
The ExpressPCB software generates plots that only their board manufacturing system can read. I have yet to be able to produce an "iron on" transfer from EPCB software and I've been using their services for a long time. In any case, you can get three high quality miniboards made (3.8 inches x 2.5 inches) for 51USD plus shipping. Dunno what it would cost to send boards to DownUnder, though.
I've been thinking about creating and ordering some generic PCB boards similar to the 8 Bit Baby
www.protovision-online.de/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=97 (http://www.protovision-online.de/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=97)
but specific to Commodore computers only.
They would have a cartridge edge connector like the 8 Bit Baby but also a second connector to solder a User Port plug.
The track pattern is yet to be decided.
What do you guys think?
Quote from: Mangelore on January 16, 2008, 05:18 PM
I've been thinking about creating and ordering some generic PCB boards similar to the 8 Bit Baby
www.protovision-online.de/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=97 (http://www.protovision-online.de/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=97)
but specific to Commodore computers only.
They would have a cartridge edge connector like the 8 Bit Baby but also a second connector to solder a User Port plug.
The track pattern is yet to be decided.
What do you guys think?
I developed a generic expansion port board many years ago and updated it a few years ago using EPCB's software. It is almost identical to a Jameco part that was available in the past, except it is silkscreened with numbers and grids for parts placement, and has a 24 x 35 hole pattern, with plated through holes to which parts may be soldered. There are no traces, so it can be wired any way that's needed.
This sort of layout is more generic that the Proto-Vision Online part, is not subject to the ridiculous EU taxes that a German company has to charge, and is more adaptable to the sorts of projects that routinely get kicked around here. They work out to about 12 USD each if I get 50 made.
I use www.silvercircuits.com, but I've never done a true production run. Their boards are awesome, looks like glass finish, and as the name denotes, are silvered, not HASL.
Jim
Mangalore, I might be interested. I thought about laying one out here (no biggie, but lots of other irons in the fire. It would be nice if it had a pinout for a 16kB ROM, as a way to make a quick cartridge (so folks could buy them for cart use if needed, but the userport/cart port woud be included as well.
I was interested in the 8 bit baby, but it was rather expensive for the value.
Jim
Quote from: StyleCHM on January 16, 2008, 02:14 PM
Andrew: pm your snail mail address and Ill post you some connectors. Save that poor modem! :D
You've got user port connectors?
indeed, I bought 50 of em so I wouldnt run out.
Id be interested in the 8 bit baby knockoff as well. I want to design some cartridges so it would be cool to have a pcb I can use and jumper over to a breadboard.
have fun!
Quote from: brain on February 03, 2008, 02:47 PM
Mangalore, I might be interested. I thought about laying one out here (no biggie, but lots of other irons in the fire. It would be nice if it had a pinout for a 16kB ROM, as a way to make a quick cartridge (so folks could buy them for cart use if needed, but the userport/cart port woud be included as well.
I was interested in the 8 bit baby, but it was rather expensive for the value.
Jim
Hi Jim,
I was thinking of keeping the PCB very simple. One side with a cartridge edge connector and the other with tracks to solder a user port connector. Then just a bunch of holes :)
The plan was to make it as affordable as possible... not more than a few $$ a board.
Any preference as to how big should the board be?
I'll try to find some time to draw something up and post it online for feedback within a couple of days.
Cheers
Fotios
Quote from: StyleCHM on February 03, 2008, 10:10 PM
indeed, I bought 50 of em so I wouldnt run out.
Id be interested in the 8 bit baby knockoff as well. I want to design some cartridges so it would be cool to have a pcb I can use and jumper over to a breadboard.
have fun!
50 of em? That'll keep you busy for some time :)
Those connectors are hard to find in Australia.
yup, I got them from the USA.
If anyone in Oz is chasing a couple, let me know :) Damn those yanks are spoiled :)
Quote from: Mangelore on February 04, 2008, 07:31 AM
I was thinking of keeping the PCB very simple. One side with a cartridge edge connector and the other with tracks to solder a user port connector. Then just a bunch of holes :)
That would suit me perfectly :D Although the guys are probably right, you should probably include holes for at least 1 EPROM. Would make for easy custom carts :)
Quote from: Mangelore on February 04, 2008, 07:31 AM
Hi Jim,
I was thinking of keeping the PCB very simple. One side with a cartridge edge connector and the other with tracks to solder a user port connector. Then just a bunch of holes :)
The plan was to make it as affordable as possible... not more than a few $$ a board.
Any preference as to how big should the board be?
Well, it'd be nice if it fit in Jen's cart case. It appears the Solokian cart supplier in the US is no longer, but I think people would like a board that fits in a cart case, if they wanted to make a test run of a product and make it look nice.
2.2" (.1x22 fingers) and a bit seems a good width, and then whatever length would fit in the case. As noted on the DIGIMax Universal (http://www.jbrain.com/vicug/gallery/digimax) They would nicely fit on each end at 2.2".
If you use EAGLE, I can send something I started on.
If you don't want to wire up the EPROM directly with traces, if you at least put a double row .6 apart for the EPROM, so people have an easy path to wire up an EPROM.
OK, so let's go with a board that fits in a standard or Jen's cart case with provision for one EPROM.
Jim, I use Rimu PCB but have Eagle as well so feel free to send me what you've started.
can we preorder? :)
EDIT: BTW, where can I find "Jen's cart case"?
*bump*
Any progress to report?
How about an expansion port board like this? If enough people are interested I could have them produced and then shipped as required. It won't be very cheap, unfortunately for those outside the USA.
(http://unifi.bcstechnology.net/bcs.d/images/expportblank.gif)
Quote from: BigDumbDinosaur on September 25, 2008, 01:09 AMHow about an expansion port board like this? If enough people are interested I could have them produced and then shipped as required. It won't be very cheap, unfortunately for those outside the USA.
Are the pads double-sided with plated-thru holes?
I'd like to see Vcc and Ground busses go up each side, where two rows of dots are currently just abandoned.
Other than that, it looks cool.
QuoteAre the pads double-sided with plated-thru holes?
Of course. Otherwise, the board would be kind of useless, eh? BTW, the big holes at the right-hand end of the board are mounting holes that clear a 6-32 machine screw.
QuoteI'd like to see Vcc and Ground busses go up each side, where two rows of dots are currently just abandoned.
Ground isn't much of a problem, as it is available at pin 22, which is at the left end of the expansion port when facing the back of the computer. I can tie that onto the row of "abandoned" holes at the bottom (as viewed in the image) of the board.
Vcc is a problem, as it is available only at pins 2 and 3, both of which are "land-locked." I could get around it by increasing the board length and relocating the main grid to open up space near the finger pads. That would produce enough room to get a trace across to the row of "abandoned" holes at the top. A longer board will increase the cost, of course.
QuoteOther than that, it looks cool.
Thanks!
BTW, in the above image, red is the top layer and green is the bottom.
BDD, did you look at Brain's 'flippy' board referenced above? Could you make your breadboard dual-ended for the expansion and user ports like that? I think that's a really cool idea.
IMHO, the expansion port end probably doesn't need fingers that are as long as those on Jim's board, as you'd be soldering a connector to them, anyway.
QuoteBDD, did you look at Brain's 'flippy' board referenced above? Could you make your breadboard dual-ended for the expansion and user ports like that? I think that's a really cool idea.
I could but probably won't. I'm a long-time believer in designing electronics to do one thing very well rather than several things poorly. The C-128 is an electrically noisy system (very noisy) and keeping the expansion port board as compact as possible reduces problems caused by noise, both from internal sources and from the surrounding area. It's my opinion that combining two unrelated functions into the same board is not good. Of course, that's just an opinion.
BTW, the above layout was planned so I could play around with SCSI ASICs connected to the expansion port. That was why I didn't add Vcc and ground buses. In the latest incarnation I added ground (bottom row) and Vcc (top row) buses. All holes are on a 2.54 mm grid.
(http://unifi.bcstechnology.net/bcs.d/images/expportblank.gif)
Quote from: BigDumbDinosaur on September 26, 2008, 02:50 AMIn the latest incarnation I added ground (bottom row) and Vcc (top row) buses. All holes are on a 2.54 mm grid.
Cool. How many would you need to order? How much?
QuoteCool. How many would you need to order? How much?
For you, such a deal!
Seriously, I can have any quantity produced, but as you might expect, the per board cost is better at larger quantities. For example, if I have 20 made (anything less is uneconomical) it works out to about 19.50 USD per board. At a quantity of 50, the per board cost is about 11.00 USD. At 100 boards, we're down to about 8.50 USD. These boards, of course, will have solder masks and will be silk screened, as shown in the above image. Naturally, some cost will also be incurred in shipping.
Sounds like I could buy one if you order 20, two if you get 50, and three if you can buy 100. Are you noticing a pattern here? :)
Wouldn't these work for the expansion buss? http://www.vectorelect.com/Product/Plugbord/PB44C.htm
I have no idea how much they would cost.
Wow they even have a reasonable selection! Anyway for $11(q50) or less, I'd get at least 3. At $19.50(q20) I don't think I'd be interested... I might be persuaded to buy 1 if it would help. I don't like having 1 of an experimental object because they tend to break during experiments!
You know, that's probably why I like programming so much; no matter how bad you mess it up, it's unlikely you'll break anything. I believe this is more true on a Commodore than a modern OS (what a nightmare if you foul up the Win registry). That must be a main reason I love Commodores. Never occured to me before... how enlightening!
Quote from: airship on September 30, 2008, 01:16 AM
Wouldn't these work for the expansion buss? http://www.vectorelect.com/Product/Plugbord/PB44C.htm
I have no idea how much they would cost.
Go back and take another look. I quote from the site:
Contacts: 22/44 @ 0.156" Centers Ni / GoldIf you can figure out how to plug 'em into the expansion port receptacle you're a better man than I am. Even a big hammer won't make them fit. :laugh:
This is why I always ask. There's always someone smarter than me on here who can tell me what's really going on. :)