Everything that is CMD-related has been removed from my personal website at http://cottonwood.servebbs.com/wiskow . The whole point behind my personal website has always been to make hard-to-find things available to people that can't get them anywhere else. Since it seemed like Maurice had disappeared off the face of the earth, the CMD stuff fell into that category. Since it appears that he's back, and he's going to be actively selling the CMD items again, then of course I don't want to get in the way of that. Other things that I have available, like the 8250lp/SFD-1001 Technical Manual or the Blitz 128 compiler, are copyrighted as well, but if there is no viable source for people to get things like this, then I see no harm in making it available.
I hope everyone understands.
But who in their right mind would buy anything off him ?
I've been waiting for my order for 7 1/2 years.
Truly,
Robert Bernardo
Fresno Commodore User Group
http://videocam.net.au/fcug
CommVEx v5 info - http://www.commodore.ca/forum and click on ComVEX
Quote from: Blacklord on February 19, 2009, 05:05 AM
But who in their right mind would buy anything off him ?
It seems that nobody really likes this guy? Why is that?
Quote from: RobertB on February 19, 2009, 06:25 AM
I've been waiting for my order for 7 1/2 years.
Man, that sucks! I can understand why
you don't like him :D
I think it's commendable of Mr. Wiskow though, that he respects the mans copyrights :)
I always said that if Maurice contacted me and asked me to remove the CMD items from my website, then I would. He did, so I did. Now, it'll be interesting to see if he gets caught up on orders. It seems unlikely to me, but I guess time will tell...
Quote from: Andrew Wiskow on February 19, 2009, 08:52 AM
I always said that if Maurice contacted me and asked me to remove the CMD items from my website, then I would. He did, so I did. Now, it'll be interesting to see if he gets caught up on orders.
Ah, can you divulge any details of the e-mail? (Exactly what was said?)
Truly,
Robert Bernardo
Fresno Commodore User Group
http://videocam.net.au/fcug
CommVEx v5 info -- http://www.commodore.ca/forum and click on ComVEX
Quote from: RobertB on February 19, 2009, 10:00 AMAh, can you divulge any details of the e-mail? (Exactly what was said?)
I don't see why not...
He replied to a post I made on the Homestead list, where I said that Blitz 128 and other "goodies" are available on my website. Here's what he said:
Quote from: MauriceSome of those other goodies you refer to... I don't ever recall you getting permission to make available all the CMD related items for free downloading. I am asking nicely for you to remove the JiffyDOS manuals and installation instructions, the RAMLink manual, FD manual, SCPU manual, HD manual, and anything else that you are in violation of, especially the JiffyDOS roms.
Don't you realize how illegal this is. This is absolutely unbelievable.
Please remove all of this within the next 48 hours.
Thanks...
-Maurice
I then replied to him:
QuoteMaurice,
It's all been removed, per your request. The whole point behind my
personal website has always been to make hard-to-find things available
to people that can't get them anywhere else. Since it seemed like you
had disappeared off the face of the earth, the CMD stuff fell into
that category. If you're back, and you're going to be actively
selling the CMD items again, then of course I don't want to get in the
way of that. Other things that I have available, like the
8250lp/SFD-1001 Technical Manual or the Blitz 128 compiler, are
copyrighted as well, but if there is no viable source for people to
get things like this, then I see no harm in making it available.
I hope you understand.
(I just edited this to use as my first post in this thread here)
Then he replied:
Quote from: MauriceActually, I don't understand. At what point did you attempt to contact me about making all of that available? And how much of it has been downloaded? Do you realize the effect that can have? Others will now think they can make it all freely available as well.
By the way, I have brand new Blitz packages here as well since CMD bought out the remaining inventory of what was left a long time ago. But that doesn't bother me like what you have managed to do with the JiffyDOS roms and all the user manuals and disks.
Just because you think something is hard to get doesn't mean that it is legal for you to freely distribute it.
I just don't get it.
A few minutes later, he followed up with:
Quote from: MauriceI just managed to download the JiffyDOS.zip file again. I thought you said you removed everything?
There is more to removing than just changing the html page. You need to "delete" all the files.
You are still violating copyright law.
The following won't like what you are doing:
dyndns.com because you use their service for hosting this.
rr.com because you have it running on their IP address.
google.com because you use gmail to spread the word around.
This is more serious than you realize.
You better start trying to contact the copyright holders of all the other products you have on your page, for your own sake.
And another e-mail from him a little under an hour after that one:
Quote from: MauriceIt's amazing how doing a google search for "wiskow jiffydos" turns up so much info. I see where you have been very busy spreading the word about JiffyDOS being available from you for free.
You left yourself wide open with this one. There is no way you can remove everything you have done. It's people like you that destroy what's still good about this business. Way to go.
-Maurice
I replied to this last e-mail:
QuoteMaurice,
I'm truly sorry if you don't agree with the reasoning for what I did.
But I always said that if you were to ever return to making JiffyDOS
available, I would immediately remove those files from my server, and
that's exactly what I've done. I did not intend to destroy
anything... I was merely making something available wasn't available
anywhere else. Francois Leveille has also been providing the service
to people of burning JiffyDOS chips and adapters with switches, and
he, too, has always said that he'd cease providing this service if you
ever started making JiffyDOS available again.
Again, I'm sorry if you don't agree with this, and I mean no
disrespect, but you really have no one to blame for any of this but
yourself. I don't know what's been going on in your life that things
have gotten to where they are now, and it's really none of my
business, but if you hadn't stopped delivering orders, then no one
would have had to search for "alternate" means of aquiring what they
needed for their Commodore computers. I'm a huge fan of the Commodore
line of computers, and I plan to continue using them until the end of
my days.
I hope you can find it in your heart to forgive and forget in this
matter. I'll be sure to send anyone looking for JiffyDOS or any other
CMD items your way from now on.
-Andrew
And I replied to the earlier e-mail:
Quote2009/2/18 Maurice Randall <maurice@cmdrkey.com>:
> I just managed to download the JiffyDOS.zip file again. I thought you said
> you removed everything?
>
> There is more to removing than just changing the html page. You need to
> "delete" all the files.
Quite right... The whole /wiskow subdomain has now been taken offline
until I have a chance to do a full rewrite.
> You are still violating copyright law.
I'd be willing to wager that everyone who uses Commodore computers
these days is violating copyright law, and I think you know it. As an
example, it's not like you can go to a computer store and buy a new
copy of Epyx Summer Games if you want to play it and you don't already
have it. So what do you do? Most likely, you'll find a site where
you can download a d64 of it, transfer it to a disk to run on your
Commodore computer, or just run it in an emulator. Technically,
that's violating copyright law.
Maurice, I really don't feel like getting into a bicker war with you
over this. I've already apologized, and I've now removed ALL the
files from my server. Many people, myself included, try to do the
right thing and don't pirate things that are still actively being
sold. For example, I have a complete collection of Loadstar disks. I
was going to post it for people to download, but when I researched it
more, I found out that it was still being sold. I ordered a copy of
Loadstar Compleat on a CD-ROM from Fender Tucker, and I got it in the
mail soon thereafter. Anyone that asks me where they can get old
Loadstar disks, I give them contact info for Fender and let them know
they can order them from him. A couple years ago, I contacted you
several times about ordering items from you. Most of the time, I got
no response. When I did get a response, I was always told that "it'll
be available soon," even though it never was. When I asked around, I
found that everyone was having the same experience and no one was able
to get the CMD items that they needed for their Commodores. What I
did, I did in an attempt to help.
-Andrew
And there you have it... ;)
Wow! Thank you for the insight into all of this. It is interesting that he makes no mention of going back into production and just concentrates on copyright violations.
Truly,
Robert Bernardo
Fresno Commodore User Group
http://videocam.net.au/fcug
CommVEx v5 info -- http://www.commodore.ca/forum and click on ComVEX
Why hasn't someone sued the a**e off him for fraud yet ? In Australia, taking money & not delivering is a criminal offense.
I just got another e-mail from him. It sounds like this will be the last I hear from him:
Quote> I'm truly sorry if you don't agree with the reasoning for what I did.
You're right, I don't agree. What can I take from you that you would be willing to forgive me for? This is very disgusting.
That's all I have to say about it.
I am surprised by the tone of his messages. Instead of a matter-of-fact request to pull down the material, his e-mails are full of anger, seemingly blaming you for everybody else who has managed to break the copyright.
Truly,
Robert Bernardo
Fresno Commodore User Group
http://videocam.net.au/fcug
CommVEx v5 info - http://www.commodore.ca/forum and click on ComVEX
Quote from: Blacklord on February 19, 2009, 10:50 AMWhy hasn't someone sued the a**e off him for fraud yet ?
Individual users have reported success in getting their money back when the state attorney general gets involved. However, lawsuits cost money to carry out, especially when many of those who want their goods/money live out-of-the-state or out-of-the-country.
No one has tried a class-action lawsuit,
Robert Bernardo
Fresno Commodore User Group
http://videocam.net.au/fcug
CommVEx v5 info - http://www.commodore.ca/forum and click on ComVEX
Because he's acted fraudently, here it would be a police matter. He'd be facing a jail term. (And civil action).
Quote from: RobertB on February 19, 2009, 12:55 PM
I am surprised by the tone of his messages. Instead of a matter-of-fact request to pull down the material, his e-mails are full of anger, seemingly blaming you for everybody else who has managed to break the copyright.
I agree... Luckily, over 15 years of military service has trained me how to not take things personally. Like with many things, I'll just brush this off and continue on with my life, which is too precious to spend dwelling on unimportant things like this.
Quote from: Andrew Wiskow on February 19, 2009, 04:00 PM
I agree... Luckily, over 15 years of military service has trained me how to not take things personally. Like with many things, I'll just brush this off and continue on with my life, which is too precious to spend dwelling on unimportant things like this.
Well said Mr Wiskow :) And after reading all of this, one thing is for sure; I will
never by anything from Maurice Randall!
Apparantly Maaurice thinks it's ok to accept orders and payment as long as he's intending to fill the orders some day. And since he intends to fill them when he gets around to it, nobody else should make the stuff available. If he wants to find disgusting have him look in a mirror.
I suppose it's possible that he was kidnapped by aliens and is unaware of the lost time but I'm guessing he's just a dick.
I too find Maurice's tone quite disturbing. A good friend of mine, Allan Bairstow, used to import these items into the UK, first from CMD and then from Maurice himself. Allan ordered quite a lot of stuff from Maurice and paid him in advance. After seeing nothing of the order, he refunded everyone who ordered through him *out of his own pocket* as he thought that was the decent thing to do. Therefore, Allan remains many hundreds of pounds down, and has not received anything from Maurice, nor has he received a penny back. This really hurt Allan, a genuine Commodore enthusiast and a great bloke, and he has barely touched a Commodore since, which is a great shame.
Regards,
Shaun.
Unfortunately, the law is on Maurice's side in this case. He owns the IP, Andrew distributed it without permission. Andrew did the right thing in taking it down. But If Maurice wants to pursue legal action, Andrew will be screwed. Anyone who distributes ANY copyrighted work needs to know the liability they open themselves up to when they do so. The fact that Maurice is in Canada and Andrew's in the US might complicate matters to the point where it would cost Maurice too much to pursue the case. But the takedown notice has already done its harm.
The classy way for Maurice to have handled this would have been to post an announcement on the CBM boards saying he was sorry about what a douche he had been, and he was going to start distributing product again, and he would make good all past orders, and would people please quite distributing 'his' stuff for free. Then he should have taken his hits while reestablishing his business. But that's not the way he rolls. He's the victim, here. Right?
Even if Maurice starts selling them right away, and does a bang-up job of customer service from here on out, I predict that pirated JiffyDOS ROM images will remain the preferred method of distribution for this product well into the foreseeable future.
This is why we so desperately need an 'orphaned works' clause in our copyright laws - to protect people like Andrew.
That being said, if Maurice tries to sue Andrew or anyone else for illegally distributing his works, the resulting publicity will no doubt result in the CBM community rising up en masse and drowning him in mail fraud cases, so he won't win.
The guys who have been selling JiffyDOS ROMs online may have more problems - Andrew made no profit from his distributions, but they did.
In any event, Maurice has, once again, proven beyond the shadow of a doubt that he is, indeed, a douche. In my opinion.
BTW, I don't care if I desperately needed a pacemaker or I would die a horrible painful death, and Maurice was the only person in the world legally able to sell them, and he sold them for a penny apiece - I wouldn't buy one from him. I'd prefer to die rather than give him a single cent.
Quote from: airship on February 20, 2009, 01:36 AM...Maurice is in Canada and Andrew's in the US...
Maurice is in the area of Lansing, Michigan.
Unless Canada has now annexed Michigan, ;)
Robert Bernardo
Fresno Commodore User Group
http://videocam.net.au/fcug
CommVEx v5 info -- http://www.commodore.ca/forum and click on ComVEX
Quote from: RobertB on February 20, 2009, 03:09 AMMaurice is in the area of Lansing, Michigan.
Unless Canada has now annexed Michigan
Haven't they? :O
From what I've heard, Maurice has no real legal claim to anything he sells (he's a licensee, not the copyright owner), so I'm not really worried about being sued by him.
QuoteFrom what I've heard, Maurice has no real legal claim to anything he sells (he's a licensee, not the copyright owner), so I'm not really worried about being sued by him.
You're correct. Maurice has no legal standing
vis a vis the CMD intellectual property. He was granted a license to produce and sell product, which license does not confer any IP rights of any kind. Regardless, he'd be crazy to attempt any kind of legal action because of the number of disgruntled customers who'd go after him for fraud. He's lucky I never did business with him and got bilked, as I have access to the legal resources needed to sink his ship. Hmm, maybe I should order something and send money... >:D
What do you think of this (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Commodore-1581-JiffyDos-rom-chip-tested-fast-10x_W0QQitemZ290297643453QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item290297643453&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1683%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318) auction? Is it "authorized" or will Maurice hunt him down too?
Quote from: SmallCleverDinosaur on February 20, 2009, 11:06 PM
What do you think of this (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Commodore-1581-JiffyDos-rom-chip-tested-fast-10x_W0QQitemZ290297643453QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item290297643453&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1683%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318) auction? Is it "authorized" or will Maurice hunt him down too?
The bad thing about basicwayne's auctions is that he actually tries to make the EPROMs that he sells look like real JiffyDOS chips... :|
Quote from: Andrew Wiskow on February 21, 2009, 03:49 AMThe bad thing about basicwayne's auctions is that he actually tries to make the EPROMs that he sells look like real JiffyDOS chips...
Mine have globs of white tape over their little windows with something illegible written on them in shaky Magic Marker. :)
Quote from: airship on February 21, 2009, 05:43 AMMine have globs of white tape over their little windows with something illegible written on them in shaky Magic Marker. :)
Oooo, the epitome of homemade hacking. ;)
Truly,
Robert Bernardo
Fresno Commodore User Group
http://videocam.net.au/fcug
CommVEx v5 info - http://www.commodore.ca/forum and click on ComVEX
One thing is for certain: now that Maurice has re-appeared, he has a lot of bridges to build if he's serious about supporting Commodore again. I'm watching with great interest.
Regards,
Shaun.
Quote from: RobertB on February 21, 2009, 05:53 PM
Quote from: airship on February 21, 2009, 05:43 AMMine have globs of white tape over their little windows with something illegible written on them in shaky Magic Marker. :)
Oooo, the epitome of homemade hacking. ;)
Yep. I put the 'ack!' in 'hack'. :D
And the Maurice "drama" continues. Today, out of the blue, I got an e-mail from Maurice that was sent to both me and Golan:
Quote from: MauriceAndrew and Golan,
I read the rude comments both of you have left on the Lemon64 forum.
You two are proving how you don't care one way or the other what I do.
I will remember that.
-Maurice
I find it interesting that of all the people on Lemon64, he chose to single out me and Golan. I think one of the big things that Golan and I have in common is that we both tend to "tell it like it is", so if he doesn't like what we've been saying, he probably ought to take a look in the mirror and try to better himself rather than lashing out at us.
Anyway, I've chosen not to dignify Maurice's e-mail with a response. Golan, however, did reply to him:
Quote from: Golan> I read the rude comments both of you have left on the Lemon64 forum.
I find it interesting that you perceive my accurately describing your
conduct as being rude. Do you think the people you've lied to,
deceived and stolen from consider your behaviour rude?
> I will remember that.
Good for you.
If you spent half as much time trying to make right your wrongs as you
do browsing the web for comments about yourself and sending out
melodramatic emails then perhaps you wouldn't be so despised. You got
yourself into this mess and only you can get yourself out. Food for
thought.
To this, Maurice responded:
Quote from: MauriceLet me tell you something. It's people like you and Andrew who help to force companies away from the Commodore community. I'm working to get back into the swing of things and all you want to do is criticize and promote pirating. I don't need to deal with people like you. There are many others who I would prefer dealing with. There are a lot of good people out there.
End of story, Golan. I don't need to discuss this anymore with you and do not need to have any dealings with you now or in the future.
Then Golan replied:
Quote from: GolanYour conduct has driven people from the Commodore community.
> There are a lot of good people out there.
I intend to make sure they all know that you're a feckless parasite.
And Maurice replied:
Quote from: MauriceThat's exactly what I'm talking about.
I'm trying to do the right thing and you prove yourself by doing the wrong thing, rather than trying to be helpful.
So, just go ahead and tell all your buddies whatever you want to tell them. It doesn't matter to me. All you want to do is drag me down. Well, go ahead, I don't care anymore. It sounds like you are on a mission. You are good at it, too.
And finally, Golan replied:
Quote from: GolanDeeds speak. All you've done for the last few years is give excuses
and make hollow promises.
I find it amazing that there really doesn't seem to be any way to reason with Maurice. He seems to feel that he's the victim and apparently feels that he's done nothing wrong.
=|
LOL ! Bump for Golan :)
Quote from: SmallCleverDinosaurI think it's commendable of Mr. Wiskow though, that he respects the mans copyrights :)
"Mans copyrights?" Mr. Randall doesn't hold any copyrights on anything. JiffyDOS and all that other CMD stuff is still the IP of CMD. All CMD did was convey manufacturing and distribution rights to him.
Sorry, my bad, I didn't know that.
But maybe CMD also conveyed the responsibility of watching out for possible copyrights violations to him?
Whatever the case may be, I've chosen to take the "better safe than sorry" route in this matter...