Looking for a hard drive to run a BBS.

Yes, I know they are very expensive.

Let me know what you have.

I am located in North Carolina, USA

You may want to consider a floppy / uIEC/SD2IEC card if you can't find one.  You'll just need the floppy for the REL user file (assuming that it's REL) and any other REL files....  My understanding is the SD-based cards only partially support REL.

Here is what you seek, finally...
A perfect LTK with all sorts of extras.

eBay item number 300431024711
Ends in 4.5 days

Link: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=300431024711&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT&ih=020

Enjoy!

Shipping:$317.71 !!!!!!!!

Quote from: Blacklord on May 30, 2010, 04:09 PM
Shipping:$317.71 !!!!!!!!

Shipping to me was shown as $31.65, and a friend of mine in California reported the freight cost @ $44.00.

Blacklord, where are you located, Mars?
You might want to check your eBay profile settings, or something.

Not to forget, BIN was free domestic shipping, but it wouldn't include interplanetary surcharges.

AdmiralDecker

Quote from: AdmiralDecker on May 31, 2010, 02:15 AM...and Star Trek - The Next Generation was no longer relying on bulky Video Toasters, the fate of the Amiga was sealed.

Far be it for me to question the statements of a higher-ranking officer like the Admiral, but FWIW, Star Trek: the Next Generation relied on computer-controlled camerawork on physical models, matte shots/paintings, and the small effects like phaser pistol rays produced by other platforms.  IOW, Amigas were not used in ST:NG or if at all, very slightly.  It wasn't until the first 3 seasons of Babylon 5 that dozens of Amiga Video Toasters were turned into rendering farms to produce all the effects in that show.

QuoteBasing it on the Motorola 68000 processor led to "almost" the same boat as the Apple's. It got to the point where other than turning the machine on to check messages, there wasn't much more you could do with.

I find that to be a flip remark, something that could be applied to any classic computer system.

QuoteFar too proprietary, very limited expansion, narrow-minded programming requirements, and no incentive for ongoing support. So much for the Amiga…

Well, at the risk of straying more off-topic on this board, I find these comments can be used to attack all classic computer systems.  In other words, these remarks are not just Amiga-centric.

           Truly,
           Robert Bernardo
           Fresno Commodore User Group
           http://videocam.net.au/fcug
           The Other Group of Amigoids
           http://www.calweb.com/~rabel1/
           Southern California Commodore & Amiga Network
           http://www.sccaners.org

Quote from: RobertB on May 31, 2010, 05:59 AM

Quote from: AdmiralDecker on May 31, 2010, 02:15 AM...and Star Trek - The Next Generation was no longer relying on bulky Video Toasters, the fate of the Amiga was sealed.

Far be it for me to question the statements of a higher-ranking officer like the Admiral, but FWIW, Star Trek: the Next Generation relied on computer-controlled camerawork on physical models, matte shots/paintings, and the small effects like phaser pistol rays produced by other platforms.  IOW, Amigas were not used in ST:NG or if at all, very slightly.  It wasn't until the first 3 seasons of Babylon 5 that dozens of Amiga Video Toasters were turned into rendering farms to produce all the effects in that show.

QuoteBasing it on the Motorola 68000 processor led to "almost" the same boat as the Apple's. It got to the point where other than turning the machine on to check messages, there wasn't much more you could do with.

I find that to be a flip remark, something that could be applied to any classic computer system.

QuoteFar too proprietary, very limited expansion, narrow-minded programming requirements, and no incentive for ongoing support. So much for the Amiga…

Well, at the risk of straying more off-topic on this board, I find these comments can be used to attack all classic computer systems.  In other words, these remarks are not just Amiga-centric.

           Truly,
           Robert Bernardo
           Fresno Commodore User Group
           http://videocam.net.au/fcug
           The Other Group of Amigoids
           http://www.calweb.com/~rabel1/
           Southern California Commodore & Amiga Network
           http://www.sccaners.org

Not "far be it" but "CLOSE BE IT" apparently...

I promise not to come to the Amiga Forum if you'll do the reverse for me. Just grab the 2nd season cliffhanger episode off your shelf, drop the lid on your Quasar top-loader, press play, and you'll see "some" of my work (storywise).  Afterwards,  please be certain to watch the first episode of season 3, and catch the rest of the work, along with many fans' input, to conclude the "Best of Both Worlds."
Always remember, "Please be Kind & Rewind"

Should you become an LTK owner, please return to this forum and share your experiences.

AdmiralDecker

Quote from: AdmiralDecker on May 31, 2010, 02:33 AM

Quote from: Blacklord on May 30, 2010, 04:09 PM
Shipping:$317.71 !!!!!!!!

Shipping to me was shown as $31.65, and a friend of mine in California reported the freight cost @ $44.00.

Blacklord, where are you located, Mars?
You might want to check your eBay profile settings, or something.

Not to forget, BIN was free domestic shipping, but it wouldn't include interplanetary surcharges.

AdmiralDecker

Australia - and that was an absolutely ridiculous postage price - I did a check for the same size item from here to there using Australia Post & international air (with insurance) - came in at just under $AU60 - a little more than for continental US postage - how much of a profit was being made on postage alone ?

Quote from: Blacklord on May 31, 2010, 07:20 AM
Australia - and that was an absolutely ridiculous postage price - I did a check for the same size item from here to there using Australia Post & international air (with insurance) - came in at just under $AU60 - a little more than for continental US postage - how much of a profit was being made on postage alone ?

Answer: $0.00

Directly from the seller's auction description text:

Quotethe ebay shipping calculator may not be accurate for your locale.
the "shipping" charge will be the "actual" freight charged by the shipper.
i will refund any overage charged by the calculator.

The text was in Header-2 BOLD print.
Kind of hard to miss.

Do ANY BUYERS on eBay actually READ auctions, or should every seller now be prepared to genuflect in such a manner that they must educate all buyers in the basics of paying attention? I thought that was eBay’s job, or perhaps primary school.

AdmiralDecker

Quote from: AdmiralDecker on May 31, 2010, 06:35 AMI promise not to come to the Amiga Forum if you'll do the reverse for me.

Ah, just take a visit to Amiga.org or Amigaworld.net.

QuoteJust grab the 2nd season cliffhanger episode off your shelf, drop the lid on your Quasar top-loader, press play...

No Quasar top-loader but I do have a Sanyo Beta Hi-Fi.

Quote...and you'll see "some" of my work (storywise).  Afterwards,  please be certain to watch the first episode of season 3, and catch the rest of the work, along with many fans' input, to conclude the "Best of Both Worlds."

A Hollywood writer?  Interesting...

QuoteAlways remember, "Please be Kind & Rewind"

Always stand a tape on end and not on its side in order to prevent tape "sag".

QuoteShould you become an LTK owner, please return to this forum and share your experiences.

No need for a return as I shouldn't leave.  I already have a Lt. Kernal.

              Truly,
              Robert Bernardo
              Fresno Commodore User Group
              http://videocam.net.au/fcug
              July 24-25 Commodore Vegas Expo 2010 - http://www.portcommodore.com/commvex

Quote from: RobertB on May 31, 2010, 05:32 PM
     Ah, just take a visit to Amiga.org or Amigaworld.net.

Been there, done that.

Quote from: RobertB on May 31, 2010, 05:32 PM
     No Quasar top-loader but I do have a Sanyo Beta Hi-Fi.

Change the idler assembly "now" before it eats all your tapes. SFS (Sanyo/Fisher Service) notorious design flaw, poor nylon parts, rubber molecular breakdown, etc.

Quote from: RobertB on May 31, 2010, 05:32 PM
     A Hollywood writer?  Interesting...

Heck no! Just an idea guy who submitted a teleplay, after seeing "Q Who" and then got ripped-off by the "hollywood" guys. Thank you very much Mr. Berman.

Quote from: RobertB on May 31, 2010, 05:32 PM
     Always stand a tape on end and not on its side in order to prevent tape "sag".

Rewind, stand on end (vertically) with full reel at bottom.

Quote from: RobertB on May 31, 2010, 05:32 PM
     No need for a return as I shouldn't leave.  I already have a Lt. Kernal.

Glad to hear it, best club to be in. I did not place opinions regarding my views in an Amiga forum because:
1) I was speaking in retrospective observation of CBM's lack of vision (back in the day) and its direct affect on the C128's future.
2) I had no desire to yack back and forth about which of my Amiga comments might be "flip" or "generic" or just outright "insanity."

   It's been real(reel), It's been fun... But it hasn't been "real fun." 

   AdmiralDecker

Quote from: AdmiralDecker on May 31, 2010, 07:55 PMChange the idler assembly "now" before it eats all your tapes.

Already done.

Quote...got ripped-off by the "hollywood" guys. Thank you very much Mr. Berman.

Ack!  Another casualty of Berman.

QuoteRewind, stand on end (vertically) with full reel at bottom.

Right.

QuoteGlad to hear it, best club to be in.

Heh, when does the club meet? 


              Truly,
              Robert Bernardo
              Fresno Commodore User Group
              http://videocam.net.au/fcug
              July 24-25 Commodore Vegas Expo 2010 - http://www.portcommodore.com/commvex

Hrm... a new user account just to point out a LT. Kernal auction to a post regarding wanting one....  odd...

Not just a post, but a glowing review of the auction and the seller.

Here is my take(and a lot of other peoples take)

That auction was posted by this guy:  http://rearadmiral.org/

Who made all kinds of claims in regards to producing new LT. Kernal drives.  By (allegedly) doing this, he got a great number of people very excited.  He was to come to C4, he needed 3 tables, he was even supposed to help a fellow club member recover his BBS from his LT. Kernal drive mech from the late 80s!!!!!  He let slip his price point to a member, around the same price as they were when new!!!

Whaaaaaa?

Then he lists the auction with a BIN around where he wants to sell his clones.  well, it only gets bid up to $150.... a big dissapointment.  He then fails to show up at C4, leaves the club in the lurch for his tables and goes silent (at least to us)

Oh, and in the course of advertising (or spreading FUD) he says things like:

The LTK is the ONLY non-Commodore Storage
System providing Full Native Support of USR (user)
and REL (relative) Files. Other systems can
only (at best) emulate USR files but not REL files.

Hmmmm.... this seems to be an outright falsehood....

Really.  Only the LTK can support REL files?  REALLY?

So all the BBS running on CMD drives have somehow skirted the need for REL files?

Oh, and I also heard (from a reliable source aka Jim Brain) that REL files are supported on the uIEC.  Yeah. Weird.

so, big bulky, LTK clone for $700+ or a nice tiny uIEC for $55.... no brainer (no pun intended) to me....

Quote from: Dragos on June 01, 2010, 06:25 AM
Hrm... a new user account just to point out a LT. Kernal auction to a post regarding wanting one....  odd...

I'm still stuck on the postage

QuoteI'm still stuck on the postage

I'm still stuck on CMD Hard Drives and the uIEC being "Wanna-Be" devices.

Quote from: Dragos on June 01, 2010, 06:25 AM
Hrm... a new user account just to point out a LT. Kernal auction to a post regarding wanting one....  odd...

Not just a post, but a glowing review of the auction and the seller.

Agreed, sort of…

A new user account in order to post a very short response to another user. Simple courtesy, perhaps beyond the scope of some individuals.

A glowing (more like STELLAR) review of the LTK, and one or two observations of the seller’s "listing."

Advice: Try not to lose any more sleep over it.

Oh, and nice "spam" site in your reference.

Quote from: Dragos on June 01, 2010, 06:25 AM
Who made all kinds of claims in regards to producing new LT. Kernal drives.  By (allegedly) doing this, he got a great number of people very excited.  He was to come to C4, he needed 3 tables, he was even supposed to help a fellow club member recover his BBS from his LT. Kernal drive mech from the late 80s!!!!!  He let slip his price point to a member, around the same price as they were when new!!!

Whaaaaaa?

Then he lists the auction with a BIN around where he wants to sell his clones.  well, it only gets bid up to $150.... a big dissapointment.  He then fails to show up at C4, leaves the club in the lurch for his tables and goes silent (at least to us)

Where are these "claims"?  At least the next sentence uses the word "allegedly" in the beginning. It seems that there is a lot "alleged" here with no back-up. Surprise, surprise...

C4? That would be the site still under a majority of 2009 postings?
After digging around in the pages, then moving to the forums (also in 2009 headers), then going to the marketplace, a single and obscure posting states:
"Lt Kernal: Looking for one of these drives? Your wishes might come true at this year's C=4 Expo. More details coming soon."
That post was made back on March 13. There were no follow-up posts and no "details" that were apparently "coming soon."
The site is poorly managed, nothing "of import" ever seems to be updated, and it therefore carries no weight (well, as much weight as that site might carry), just like the rest of the above "rant" with regards to whatever this "hear/say" was intended to serve here.

Back to the auction listing, I don’t know if it could be considered a disappointment. The auction was only half way in, the listing was cancelled, and the status is unknown. That’s the glory of eBay. However, after minor research of "dragos on ebay" it would seem that some sellers don’t like when potential buyers ask questions about listings. So eBay might not be for just everyone. Perhaps some sellers should consider yahoo auctions? 

Quote from: Dragos on June 01, 2010, 06:25 AM
Oh, and in the course of advertising (or spreading FUD) he says things like:

The LTK is the ONLY non-Commodore Storage
System providing Full Native Support of USR (user)
and REL (relative) Files. Other systems can
only (at best) emulate USR files but not REL files.

Hmmmm.... this seems to be an outright falsehood....

Really.  Only the LTK can support REL files?  REALLY?

So all the BBS running on CMD drives have somehow skirted the need for REL files?

Hmmmm... Where to start?

The LTK "is" the only non-cbm system providing "full native support" of usr and rel files. <- did you read the word "native" or did you skip that?

Native support refers to "cbm" file definitions as per commodore business machines, their interactions between the oem computer hardware, kernel level & i/o functions, basic & m/l programming, as well as the target drive's hardware, and its ability to support these "native" cbm definitions WITHOUT emulation fudge-factories.

Cmd drives use 1541 (and other) "emulation partitions" for rel support, NOT cbm "native" support. uIEC rel definitions are NOT (at all) cbm m/l compliant, they are "their own something or other". Additionally, both devices also only emulate usr file support, NOT cbm native support.

The LTK fully supports USR and REL files to the exacting cbm standards to which they were created, no emulation or "wanna-be" instances of any sort under any conditions. The LTK was designed with cbm personnel closely onboard in the development phases and even the first 5mb device, running LK Dos v5, made its debut (in 1985) with "Full cbm Native Support."
No System other than the LTK has ever accomplished this.

Gee, that was really tough to understand, wasn't it?


AdmiralDecker

Quote from: Blacklord on June 01, 2010, 08:37 AM
I'm still stuck on the postage

Something is indeed still "stuck somewhere".
Hope the breathing is not impaired by it...

AdmiralDecker

Quote from: redrumloa on June 01, 2010, 08:54 AM
I'm still stuck on CMD Hard Drives and the uIEC being "Wanna-Be" devices.

Uh-Oh: The breathing impairment has become contagious...

AdmiralDecker

Yes, YOU know nothing about C4 therefore, I am wrong. 

That douche at rear admiral requested 3 tables with power at C4 this year, then failed to show up.  he made an agreement with one of or board members to help with his drive, again, a fail. 

I can't help he is too cheap to have real webhosting and has bullshit spam in all his links.

What I can observe is you think you know everything and apparently came here to bash everyone who doesn't agree with you.

LTK, a niche artifact....

There are more options today than any other time, who the f**k would want a LTK to USE?  Want to collect it? I get that, but do not try to tell me there are very many people USING a LTK on any kind of regular basis.  uIEC?  I would bet more than 100 using them regularly....

anyway, your tone is that of REAR ADMIRALs when discussing the "super new LTK clones", so my money is still on you are him.....

And just to butter the other side of the bread, I don't claim that hollywood stole my star trek script....

FFS, what a tool.....

Quote from: Dragos on June 01, 2010, 02:50 PM
Yes, YOU know nothing about C4 therefore, I am wrong.

That douche at rear admiral requested 3 tables with power at C4 this year, then failed to show up.  he made an agreement with one of or board members to help with his drive, again, a fail. 

I can't help he is too cheap to have real webhosting and has bullshit spam in all his links.

What I can observe is you think you know everything and apparently came here to bash everyone who doesn't agree with you.

LTK, a niche artifact....

There are more options today than any other time, who the f**k would want a LTK to USE?  Want to collect it? I get that, but do not try to tell me there are very many people USING a LTK on any kind of regular basis.  uIEC?  I would bet more than 100 using them regularly....

anyway, your tone is that of REAR ADMIRALs when discussing the "super new LTK clones", so my money is still on you are him.....

Knowing NOTHING about C4 places me in a group where I plan to remain. Thank you.
I personally have no concerns regarding the rest of your C4 comments, since you are apparently biased in some maniacal fashion, as to wit: irrational behavior by directly insulting me because I posted a response to another inquirer, who was looking for an LTK. You might have chosen a standard post/response manner, rather than outright hostility based on some other subject, that continues to drift further yet from the response posted to the original inquiry. Sadly, this demonstrates limited intelligence.

You now flip-flopped from the "guy" who posted the auction listing, to the "guy" who posted the response regarding the auction listing. Hint: The lost & found department is on Floor 13, take the elevator to your left!

I never "bashed" anyone. I posted a link to an auction on eBay for a member to see in hopes of helping someone find what they were seeking. That was all. Afterwards, everyone else jumped in to "bash the LTK".  I disagreed with comments, and posted responses appropriately, and based them on facts and logic. Something which eludes most these days.

And, to your next comment:
A Theatrical Note - A teleplay is not a script.

AdmiralDecker

My mistake.  They only stole your "idea". Got it.

I wonder, how many other deluded morons believe this kind of thing?

Yes, you attacked no one.... 

I suppose we peasants shan't ever be allowed to have conversations above our "limited intelligence"

Topic locked - it's descending into a flame fest.

I have a option of what the sysgen is,  but would like to hear an explantion of what it does from other members,  thanks.

Quote from: Dragos on June 01, 2010, 06:25 AMOh, and in the course of advertising (or spreading FUD) he says things like:

The LTK is the ONLY non-Commodore Storage
System providing Full Native Support of USR (user)
and REL (relative) Files. Other systems can
only (at best) emulate USR files but not REL files.

Hmmmm.... this seems to be an outright falsehood....

But technically true.  Other systems use a 1541 emulation mode to produce the effect of a RELative or USeR file.  The Lt. Kernal's implementation produces an exact duplicate.

There is a bit of a booby-trap associated with using RELative files on a multiplexed (MUXed) Lt. Kernal system.  Owing to the 512 byte sector size common to the hard disks used with the system, the LK DOS may buffer several records at a time in the host adapter shadow RAM.  This effect means that if consecutive records are accessed, less disk activity will theoretically occur.  This is all well and good for performance.

However, and this is where the booby trap comes in, if one workstation reads and modifies a record but then does no further file access, but keeps the file open, the modified record image will not be immediately flushed to disk.  If a second workstation then opens the same file and reads the same record, it will get the old version, not the new one.  Carrying on with this, if the second workstation then modifies the same record and closes the file or positions to a different record within the file, its changes will be flushed.  Later on, when the first workstation repositions or closes the file, its changes will be flushed, overwriting the previous ones.

It was for this reason, and others, that I did not use RELative files on a MUXed system.  Instead, I went to the trouble to develop code that would pair a type 5 (contiguous data) file with a key file to produce an ISAM-like database engine.  This eliminated the buffering issue, and also gave me a convenient record locking mechanism.  Of course, all of this has to be done in machine code, so it's not a trivial process.

But, to sum up, the LK does produce a true USeR and RELative file implementation, the latter with record sizes up to 3327 bytes (contrary to the official documentation, which says 3072 bytes maximum).  BTW, if there was a market for it, I'd resurrect the ISAM database engine for the 128.  It worked very well with a MUXed system and was fast, due to direct access the LK DOS primitives.